The ‘Exact Science’ Of Nadi Jothidam
Nadi Jothidam is the name of an ‘exact science’ by which all details about a person can be told by consulting palm-leaf inscriptions attributed to Agastya Muni, a very famous ancient sage from the South. There is, supposedly, one palm-leaf inscription for every human on this earth, past present and future! Taking into account population explosion, the whole place should be chock full of palm leaves, but miraculously this is not so. This could mean two things- either the ancients had the foresight to know as to who would visit the place and hence only the bio-data of those visitors would be available,or the leaves are preserved in some format wherein terabytes of data could be compressed and stored. The prints would be taken after the candidate arrives on the spot!
Either way it goes to show the remarkable wisdom of our ancients! Anyway, after one arrives at the place their thumb impression is taken along with their date of birth. Then, the palm leaf pertaining to the individual is searched for. This is the source of the name Nadi- search. There are a number of write-ups praising its accuracy and there are blogs testifying to the same. There have been numerous accounts stating that the practitioners of Nadi have an accurate method of telling all about the past, present and future of any individual. All they need for identifying the right leaf is the thumb-print of the person and the date of birth.
On my travels with my friends, we happened to be passing by near where it was supposed that the ‘original’ Nadi leaves were kept- the Vaithishwara Temple near Chidambaram in Tamil Nadu. I decided to look into this matter here, along with Rajendran and Murugan from the Tamil Nadu Science Forum. I decided to follow Rajendra’s contact’s advice and look for Shiva Swami of station road who was supposedly the best of the lot and would charge only Rs. 500 per consultation.
When we reached the place at the entrance of the village there were numerous signs inviting us to the ‘original nadi jothidam’, ‘the one and only Nadi consultant’, ‘beware of touds’ [sic] (touts!) etc. On enquiring further, we found out know that the place was full of Shiva Swamis as it seemed to be the most popular name around. Thinking “a rose by any other name…”, we went to the nearest Shiva Swami. This too was probably already entered in my leaf! It was a toud who ended up taking us to this place despite our caution. On entry, we were told that we had come to the right place as it was the place where Agastya Muni had deposited his original collection of palm leaves. We were also told that it was a holy place, a madam- a hermitage (not to be confused with madam!), and not a commercial enterprise. On enquiry as to how much it cost, we were informed that it depended on what we wanted. If the interpretations were to be made in Tamil then it would be Rs.200 (~ $5, US), if translations were to be made it would be more. It would be fifty rupees extra for audio tape recording. I included the condition that the payment would be made only if what was said was correct, and this was agreed upon.
I was told to write my date of birth on a sheet of paper and two thumb impressions of my right hand were taken. That was all that was needed to look for the palm leaf with my life story written on it. It was, however, subject to availability I was told, as I was asked to sit down in a fixed place while the search for it was on. We declined this invitation and told them that we would go around the place and come later. When we came back after ten minutes, we were told that I was lucky as my leaf had been found, and that it would be read. When I asked the permission of the person reading it for it to be photographed, he declined. When I asked whether he would pose for a picture he was vehement in his refusal. Luckily, I had already managed to take a few pictures of the place and its fixtures.
The standard declaimer was put forth before the reading started. I was told that although all efforts had been made to get the script of my life, there could be some errors in interpretation. So, I had to answer yes or no to statements made about my life.
First I was asked where I came from. When I replied Udupi, he said that had been accurately mentioned in his leaf. The next question was whether I was a Brahmin or not. When I asked what the leaf said, I was told non-brahmin. When I said yes, he made the very earth-shaking declaration that I was a non vegetarian! I asked him to go on and he said that both my parents were alive. Since, both of them are no more, he said that the inference had been probably arrived at, by the presence of their souls on earth! I had made no attempts to send them to heaven by performing the required rituals. I was also informed that my father had been a government servant and had retired. That would have been news to him if he were alive. He had never worked for anyone else in his lifetime. Then I was told that I too had been in government service and ha retired (that last part is not a very difficult conclusion going by my age!) The Pais of Manipal who had been my employers at Manipal University would be glad to hear of this elevation in their status from an influential family to a government organization. The next statement was about the day of my birth and I was told that I had been born on a Monday and under Makara Rashi. When I replied I did not know whether either of them was true or false, I was told that I am a Muslim!
Then I was told the following:
1. I owned the house in which I live (true) and so did my father (false).
2. I had two wives (I haven’t met the second one yet)
3. I had two children from my deceased first wife and for their sake married for the second time. I misled him here saying that my first wife was not deceased, but I had divorced because she had no issue. The children were of my second one. The interpreter of Nadi fell into the trap and agreed with me. He also said that there was a small error in his reading.
4. I had two brothers and one sister. This is true but when I said it was wrong he changed it to one brother and one sister.
5. My fathers name starts with one of the dozen alphabets listed. When I said no, he followed with a dozen other alphabets. When I replied in the negative again, he was flabbergasted.
About thirty minutes had passed and getting tired of this, I told the Nadi reader that most of what he had said was nonsense. He got angry at this and told me that I should have been honest with him. I replied that he should have known about this because his own Nadi leaf would have contained the information that his powers would be tested on that day. When I asked him whether I had to pay for all the rubbish that he had told, he flounced out of his own establishment with the Nadi leaves pertaining to my life under his arm, leaving us there. After waiting for a few minutes for him to come back, we came out. By then I had gathered how the so called Nadi fortune tellers manage to make ‘accurate predictions’ of the past and future.
The leaves are just a prop for them. They are covered in scribbles which only the Nadi reader can supposedly interpret. The information about the client is gathered by the following methods:
- The client and those accompanying them are asked to wait until the proper leaves are found. During this time they are asked to wait in a room which is wired and the conversation is spied upon.
- The interpreter is a clever ‘cold-reader‘. He notes the reactions of the client and those who accompany them, to check the accuracy of the predictions.
- Pointed questions are asked to ‘predict’ the background of the clients- questions like caste, religion etc.
- Names and other specific details are rooted out by trying to guess the first alphabet of the word followed by the second one and so on by a process of elimination.
- Most of the information is provided by the client from our reactions to yes or no questions or from subconscious body signals. In my case, since I am quite experienced in providing misleading body signals and since those accompanying me had no knowledge about my personal matters, the reader was not in a position to acquire any knowledge about me by this method, thus playing into the trap.
Once the Swami realized that he was being misled and that I was a hard nut to crack, he backed out. So much for the ‘accurate science’ of Nadi Jothidam!
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Ravindranath Menon,
where do you suggest i get a genuine nadi reading?
i am interested. i belive.
We are anxiously waiting Mr.Menon. Please let us know on this site!Of course others too are welcome. I would suggest that you go to go to Vaitheeswaran Kovil where the nadi jotishars are dime a dozen. But, I dont know about ‘genuine nadi’ readings because they are all the same, doing cold readings on gullible people.
I am not to suggest the contact details of readers of Naadi here as it would tantamount to promoting.Those who are interested could inquire and find. There are established readers with credibility . My aim is not to provide or promote anyone. What I have written is from my experiences. I do not want to wear an agent’s Cap.
How convinient. But consider this – all you need to do is find a ‘genuine’ astrologer and show in a controlled setup that.astrology works. That’s it. You will find us singing praises of it. I will donate a few months of my salary to the cause of spreading such a profound ancient technique. I’m sure others will too. So think about it.
I have proved it to be fraud each time giving the names and addresses each time. Mine is any way known, but Menon keeps telling that he knows genuine people who can forecast correctly. In my next one the fraud of nadi jotidam I have given the photos of the shop, the address and even that of the reader.
That shows very well what Nadi jotidam is- a fraud and a con game.
IT 1000000……….% TRUE
What is true?
I am surprised to read this article written by an ignorant in the field and a bunch of other onlookers who talk like the eight Blind men who describe an elephant.
First and foremost Nadi Astrology per se is perfect and right more than divine.The Nadi readers( so called Astrologers) might be Good, bad crooks straight forward but all of them making a life by the reading. Having said so they are doing it for money and not for charity. I make a full stop here for the cost of part of it.
Coming to the system and accuracy, unless you tell the truth they will never be able to find out the leaves that predicts your life since the first bundle they bring to you is just an index.
The readers are basically un educated and you cannot expect intelligent interpretation from these labourers. However the leaves contain valuable information based on Vedic Astrology that gives you insight for future life.Remedies are based on vedic Astrology and are effective . But the remedies that Nadis suggest are very costly and not affordable by the common Man. Tell me what is affordable for the comoner today? except perhaps 2 square meals!!
If you need to understand the divinity of Nadi astrology first you need to be blessed by the celestial masters and be able to get advice from Prasna Nadi, Jeeva Nadi or Brahma nadi. In all these Nadis no questions are asked and no answers are required. They just open the leaf and read to you. They are made possible by live letters which automatically writes like the automatic writing by the spirits that is explained by Many civilized and educated people.Prasna Nadi gives answers to your question whatever it might be. If you ask about intricate scientific principle or spiritual secret the answers appear( I have first hand experience about this ) But who asks about all these matters? every one require answers to questions like ‘when I would become P.M/CM’ or when i get lottery?
Many unraveled secrets are there in the universe which I and you are not aware . There are more crooks in this world than the originals . This is true in the case of Politicians, bureaucrats,Bloggers, readers Hawkers, manufacturers, Astrologers , Doctors , Hospitals and Nadi Astrology Too!! The leaves have directed many as per the divine wish of the celestial masters. But they could act only through mortal beings and majority of them are crooks and fake. It is not the fault of the system but of the society in Kaliyuga.
Inquire before you criticize! Do not think that you are Omniscient and all pervading. What I could see from the top of a 30 story-ed building , you on the ground cannot see but that doesn’t mean that what i see is wrong. It is your Limitation1! Good luck!
yes. We went back after three years and you can see the farce again on a write up -the fraud of Nadi jotidam on the same site.
I am not here to research who my grand fathers grand father was simply because I knew that he had existed, irrespective of another man’s research.It is derivation.This matter is not subject to research like research on the taste of Laddu by 100 men who do not have tongue.It is an experience and all experience cannot be explained only realised.
Hang on to it mate. Doesnt make it true just because you say so. BTW, there have been a number of documentaries on how the leaves are made etc.
Documentaries with vested interest do not make it wrong either. Dr. B.V. Raman the doyen of Vedic Astrology has vouchsafed the changing of letters and Language in nadis in his memoirs. The first person has numerous experience on the answers that could not have been answered by ordinary mortals leave alone th 7th std. reader. You hang on to your ignorance on the subject but do not try to prove your misinformation as right. Supreme court of India in its historic Judgement where Prof K.N. Rao was the defence counsel gave the verdict for the Astrology to be included in Universities. So there is nothing new in your argument and I make a full stop to this debate here.
I have ‘experienced’ and ‘realized’ that astrology is pure nonsense. As someone once said, “Tide goes in, tide goes out”. You can’t explain that.
No issues on the view points. My point was against claiming by the so called scientific tempered ignorants that they are the only species on earth with the so called brain. Logic does not reveal the truth it only add to the verbosity of the blind men explaining the elephants.
Nice strawman you setup there. If you jump off a building, you will fall down. Gravity couldn’t care less about viewpoints, you see. You can’t have a warped worldview and then complain when the warpedness is pointed out.
It is a worn out argument of the ‘elite’ atheists. In fact a realized soul could understand that the ultimate of adwaitam, Buddhism and atheism are different interpretations of a single truth. But the dogmatic philosophy that the incomplete ‘science’ perennially on research only could explain the ‘truth’ is pitiable. Going by your Gravity theory and the other currency note theory Can you agree that the medical science that could neither diagnose nor cure many a illness is bogus and is a superstition? I neither desire to make change your ‘Divine’ philosophy nor in a position to reply mediocre and repeated questions already raised in many forums that has only school debate value.However do not be overambitious to conquer the unknown by your limited logic, comprehension and understanding.The unknown could be realized not materially but getting outside the Box of this limited body, that you logicians would find too difficult to digest. No one could attempt to teach E=MC2 to a school boy.
Menon,
Incoherent rants aside, I see that Prof. Nayak has proposed a test below. Are you up to it?
Menon.
you could keep on ranting and raving about the so called ‘research’ you are doing you could so so called research on 2+2=10 all your life and claim that you have depth of knowledge in the field and say that you are an authority on that which does not make that correct. If one does not want to take an objective test saying that it is superfluous it is their headache and an easy way of escape. Like what was done to one of us when we went to a Nadi research center near Tambaram. Because the guy could not do any cold reading, he went on opening new leaves and then escaped! When it is claimed that only people who are destined to go to a particular place go there and how is it that such an individuals leaves are missing? I was told by the person in Vaitheeswaran Kovil that every morning they go to the temple to collect the leaves of those who are going to come there on that day as the deity or whatever that is there knows beforehand as to who is going to come there and hence hands over those of the people who are going to come there that day. When this is the case how can any reading go wrong? When osama bin laden was hiding one of your Nadi pundits could have found out his hiding place by looking up his leaves and got the huge award instead of earning pittances by duping poor gullible people and suggesting to them rituals at the temple which of course can be done at a ‘discount’ price by their minions there. Besides our country has been subject to so many terrorist attacks and scams. These Nadi pundits could have fond out the culprits in each of these cases. They could have looked up the leaves of any one of the victims and done that!
One can always put up strawman arguments that they would not condescend to such levels. Of course nothing prevents them from coming to such levels when there are gullible people around who will fall into their traps and wiling to pay. Well you keep on harping upon ‘genuine’ ones. let us have the name and address of one such who is willing to do predictions for us. Again, when I had gone to this place in 2011 I had given every detail very correctly of my dead brother in law who had died a few months back- they were satisfied his date of birth they predicted good health for him and that he would live up to 80plus while he actually passed away at the age of 56 years. So much for your accuracy of predictions.
Mr, Nayak,
First you cheated them by impersonation acting that you were your dead brother. That apart , you approach any of these beyond logic experiences with myopic eyes and no one could help about it.
I make it clear again that there are 60% frauds in naadi astrology why even among normal astrology practitioners. It is there among you atheists and so called rationalists too as what I see among the present generation communists of kerala, unlike the great souls of earlier years. Fraud is man made and it is there in pathological test too that you cannot refute.
Then about predicting about hide outs of terrorists and earthquakes. No one has ever asked about it. Why can’t you approach a prasna nadi reader and ask about genuine concerns about the welfare of the people. Your aim is to disprove something not to prove anything. Where as I had asked such questions and had convincing answers. Astrology is a counselling science and not a predictive magic wand. People could make use of its abundant guiding value in taking important decisions otherwise known to them after a lot of trial and error like in education, career and health care. Do not be dogmatic and make the earth dark by closing your eyes.I have nothing against the per se rationalism but everything against dogmatism . No one could assume the wisdom of seers are far less than the medicore rationlists of Today. I am reminded about the mathematical wisdom of Baskaracharya, Varahamihira, and Jaimini who were all astronomers and astrologers of repute. While you believe in everything that is proved in laboratory refuse to accept experiences as biased and invalid. If we are so omniscient why can’t we produce human blood in a lab so far and make an artificial brain that could be replacd. You might say that we are in research. Yes we would do the research until our grave on certain maters since many mysteries on earth are incomprehensible though not mysterious. All of these facts have a sound scientific basis that we mortals could not decipher until today. Accept your limitations and be accommodating but in your fight against fraud, cheating,and scientific temper I am 100 percent with you but not to despise all the wisdom that i am not able to comprehend.
Exposing fraud Naadi astrologers is of more importance for us believers than for you non believers and Good luck in your bold endeavours.
ca i get the address of nadi jothisha kendram.
The so called Nadi jotidam places are a dime a dozen in Vaitheeswaran Kovil.The address of the one we exposed in this link http://nirmukta.com/2011/06/13/the-fraud-of-nadi-jothida/.
There are ‘branches’ all over India each one calling itself as the genuine one!
Let them read the number of a sealed currency note and write it down then we will open the envelope and check it out. If they are the same we will agree that Nadi jotidam or any other ‘science’ that is claimed to be accurate is perfect and acceptable.
Respected Prof Nayak saab,
Who wants to convince whom? As all we know there is only one single truth that all of us try to decipher but unfortunately still at large since we are imprisoned in this mortal and limited body. Sankaras’ advaita and Ramanuja’s vishita advaita . Buddhas Soonya theory and the theory of atheism all are attempt on this direction . The truth as I realized is difficult to comprehend the same way by you and vice versa, which is why Swami Vivekananda told once the greatness of my philosophy could be comprehended only by another Vivekananada. This is true in all cases.
Coming to Naadis Live nadis could tell what happens at a different place in real time and direct you to your aims. I had experienced it. But I am not sure whether persons of great power would even consider a trivilous challenge . It is like my 3 year grand daughter challenging me for a fight!! I am afraid there would be no takers for your challenge and you could continue to boast of your theories and I of Mine.Let us co exist , for the universe gives us freedom for the same. Glad to communicate to you online!
“But I am not sure whether persons of great power would even consider a trivilous challenge ”
Really, then why they hell these persons of great powers charge money for their service. If they are great powers why suck up innocent victimes?
If any one sucks money from any gullible by cheating they are to be booked under law. When I say persons of power it means the celestial ones who answers your queries. You people have not understood the concept, the truth and secracy of Naadi astrology the real. You are still seeing the elephant blind. The persons of power never requires money. The readers and custodians charge as per their need and greed. It is a waste of time explaining to peopel who are alien to some system about its intricacies. Read and enquire about it and then debate.
Yes Menon, you are the smart guy here, we have all researched and it is not a matter of debate, it is a fact that they lie and cheat with some cool tricks. You can continue giving them money and calling them great ones if you dont want to accept the truth. Naadi astrology is false as are any other types of astrology.
“If any one sucks money from any gullible by cheating they are to be booked under law”-
Which means all of those Nadi astrologers should be booked under law. Can you refer me to any astrolger who don’t charge a fee?
Or if they charge money they should be willing to subject themself to a test to prove that the service they offer is genuine. In that case they have to take up the challange from Mr. Nayak.
MR. Hari You are talking to a person who has been researching on vedic astrology for the past 4 decades. and one who received innumerable suggestion on siddha medicine that was alien to siddha doctors and got cured of problems. Now having said so I am unsubscribing from this debate since the forum is dogmatic and refuse to accept another point of view. I am not doing astrology for my livelyhood .If you would like to know more about astrology and the kind of scientific reserach going on in this field by people of IITians and scientists have a look at http://vedicastrologer.org/ just as an example.
Menon,
Instead of all these arguments, just show that astrology works as claimed in a controlled setup. If it works, then rationalists will gladly accept it.
“forum is dogmatic and refuse to accept another point of view”. Mr. Menon, you have not presented any cosntructive arguments other than rambling on celestial powers. You should provide some scientific evidence to support your case.
You joking…..
Let me told you to test this guys I asked my father to sent thumb impression of my cousine who lives 400 km far from our house. My father gave thumb impression and left premises in 5 minutes. How can you spy whose thumb print it got?
My name is begin with Letter R and ends with H. for you Its six letter name. What’s the name ?
Rakesh
Ramesh
Rajesh
Ravish
Rukesh
Rupesh
In my cousine’s case her name and parents name were predicted in the first instance (True). We allowed to record as well.
let us have another experiment with a thumb impression of some one whose name I shall not reveal to you. Let us see what happens.
Most of the people here have not understood the process properly.
The process as I understand is as follows. The initial search is based on the thumb impression (in most cases). This is an index and several possible leaves are first shortlisted based on the thumb impression. Only one of the several such leaves will refer to the subject. They open each of these index leaves and try to find out which one refers to you. The questions such as your parents are alive, you have so many brothers etc are read out from such leaves and you are asked whether it is true or false. If it is false they go to the next leaf. In some cases first, second or third questions may be correctly answered and then there may be a negative. They discard that and go to the next and so on until they find the index leaf which matches in all respects. They then fetch the detailed information regarding that index leaf and read out the contents. There is no prediction made except the interpretation of the language.
When the subject gives false answers obviously a wrong set is identified as belonging to the subject and further reading will definitely incorrect.
Beyond this, what is fascinating is that there are certain facts already written there several thousand years back. I am not much concerned if the future predictions become completely true or not. But the phenomenon of Nadi Grantha is fascinating. Hope you find a genuine reader not a city based fake.
Nadi Jothidam is a fraud method available in Tamilnadu.
1.They used gather the information from the person who is introducing you to the Joshyar (Astrologer).
2.mostly the intermediate person will be the source for information.
3.because the intermediate fellow is the only bridge to you and Joshyar.
4.My friend once convinced verymuch with nadijoshyam, Then i helped him to find out the person, who passed his info to Joshyar.
No body can Predict future !! Bcos there is nothing called Future , The moment we move to future its no more future, it becomes PRESENT !!
Not all are freaks. You have yet to meet and get to know the real ones.
Regarding your last sentence:-
That is the very reason you could choose the future and it is only alignment with the situations available. However the basic instincts and quality of the base substance( I call it soul and you could call it X) could align only in a directed manner in 99% cases. Future predictions cannot be 100% true as we could change and choose the same with our limited freedom. As a singer i could choose among many variations like Ghazal, carnatic or Rock to specialize in, but cannot be a sportsperson on another day. I can make a dog a better Dog but difficult to make it a cat. Nadi astrology( The original versions) in real sense only counsels and not predicts. Astrology is a counseling tool not a predictive tool. But in most cases people rarely change their born instincts and Good Astrologers scores points there.
yes. I also do cold reading in which more than 95% is true. Soon after we exposed the nadi fellow, i went to Peiryar Maniammai university where I called a lady worker and told her 20 things about herself nd her family which were all true and she was totally taken in by my predictions and handed over her jewellery to me for performing rituals to ward off evil to her son.
you can not say this nadi astrology is “non sense”.. for 99% of people it will be true.. and rarely for some people like you u, it may come wrong.. because ofcourse those persons are not god to be 100% correct.. whatever is written about u, they will try to tell u up to their knowledge.. so dont spread some rubbish bad rumors about this nadi astrology
of course for people who make good money it has to be true so with religion and so with philosophy.
extremely corrupt men and people run the world and exploit others to starvation especially in india.
Could the reason for this system of astrology seeming to work 99% of the time, simply be that 99% of the people who visit such astrologers, are either people with a credulous disposition to start with or people who visit them during times of crisis of desperation when their critical faculties don’t work well enough?
It came wrong for all of us who gave false clues doing his attempts at cold reading.
for 99% of people it will be true.. How do you know this? do you have any statistical data?
If people like you are gulliable enough to beleive Nadi Astrology and part with your money, knock yourself. But our job is to protect innocent people from frauds.
I think the best way to trap them is when they ask you questions about your name, life, etc……just LIE to them and then after lying to them find out if they still reveal correct things about you.
Of course they can read out the past and family backgorund etc because 99% are endogamous and marry within their castes so therefore prediction about them is that much more easy.
However it would be insane for us to believe that those pandits who read out is due to Hindu religion or something.
It is just common sense.